OT: Calling ALL Old Farts?
- Thread starter JimPerry
- Start date
fernando_g
Senior Member
AndyGadget
Senior Member
Fifty six for me : Old enough to know better but young enough not to want to.
inglewoodpete
Senior Member
Oh Dippy, we know you're only a middle-aged fart.This thread is a relief - notice how the spelling, grammar and formatting is so much better with Old Farts.
I'm getting there!
I can tell because I moan a lot
Today's moan is LED light bulbs (mains 240V).
void Moan(miserable quality) {
I bought 3 Kosnic 8W 3000K. All was well to start with.
According to Lux light-meter about equiv to 40-45W old fashioned bulb. Good.
Last night, first one failed. 6 days old - ~30 hours usage. Hardly the 30,000 hour life advertised.
Nice LEDs powered by cheap Chinese electronics.
My advice; convert lighting to 12V and LEDs and keep the power control PSU away from the heat.
However, after my neighbour's ChCh PSU caught fire I'd advise the extra fiver and buy Western. Sorry Stan.
} // (Probably temporarily)
I can tell because I moan a lot
Today's moan is LED light bulbs (mains 240V).
void Moan(miserable quality) {
I bought 3 Kosnic 8W 3000K. All was well to start with.
According to Lux light-meter about equiv to 40-45W old fashioned bulb. Good.
Last night, first one failed. 6 days old - ~30 hours usage. Hardly the 30,000 hour life advertised.
Nice LEDs powered by cheap Chinese electronics.
My advice; convert lighting to 12V and LEDs and keep the power control PSU away from the heat.
However, after my neighbour's ChCh PSU caught fire I'd advise the extra fiver and buy Western. Sorry Stan.
} // (Probably temporarily)
mmmmm all this cute baby boomer introspection is rather boring and tedious. The real question and issue is; where are all the young people on the forum? I would have hoped they were hacking and coding away, but perhaps the PICAXE is too boring and old-fart-school for them ????
grim_reaper
Senior Member
My 12 year old son agrees that young people think electronics are boring - despite them being glued to gadgets alllll day long!! I guess they don't appreciate the years of electronics development that have culminated in the i-Pad.
On the other hand, my 8 year old daughter is like a voice controlled breadboard machine! She loves it when I say 'put that red wire from A12 to P4'. I'll get her inducted into the forum as a sixteenth birthday treat
On the other hand, my 8 year old daughter is like a voice controlled breadboard machine! She loves it when I say 'put that red wire from A12 to P4'. I'll get her inducted into the forum as a sixteenth birthday treat
Makrobak, I guess it goes with the territory. For older people PICAXE is a hobby.
Schoolkids will come and go. Dive in, homework done, jump out and go to Xbox.
There are a few youngsters (e.g. Nick) who have stayed.
In industry in UK it is very difficult to get electronic engineers. We have two really good young graduate engineers at work.
Sometimes they go to schools giving talks and presentations to try and get interest from 14 - 16 yo.
They usually come back in despair. Neither had heard of PICAXE so a bit more penetration is required by Rev-Ed.
Without doubt there are some good youngsters around.
And even if they start with PICAXE they move on up. Natural. Once you've learnt to read you tend to move up the literary scale.
So, the old farts will persist. And Rasperry Pi will be a book-end in a couple of years.
Schoolkids will come and go. Dive in, homework done, jump out and go to Xbox.
There are a few youngsters (e.g. Nick) who have stayed.
In industry in UK it is very difficult to get electronic engineers. We have two really good young graduate engineers at work.
Sometimes they go to schools giving talks and presentations to try and get interest from 14 - 16 yo.
They usually come back in despair. Neither had heard of PICAXE so a bit more penetration is required by Rev-Ed.
Without doubt there are some good youngsters around.
And even if they start with PICAXE they move on up. Natural. Once you've learnt to read you tend to move up the literary scale.
So, the old farts will persist. And Rasperry Pi will be a book-end in a couple of years.
hippy
Ex-Staff (retired)
I think most are just getting on with it and doing it, mainly as part of their school work, and perhaps not so much outside, and mostly with less than regular interaction with the forum.
Lack of forum interaction could simply be because they have little or no need for it, are happy with what they are doing and not encountering issues, or have more local resources such as other students and teachers to help them along. The forum probably attracts mostly hobbyists and non-student individuals because they don't have those alternatives and don't have the support they would have from within an educational environment. The students we see are probably those who want more or additional help to what they could otherwise get or are looking for different perspectives.
There's probably still a natural feeling amongst students that school is school and outside that is something else bar the homework and any hobbies which may bridge the two.
There are many PICAXE users we never hear anything from and we can never really tell how many people are reading the forum but not posting. There is a steady stream of new members signing-up who may not be posting and probably more who browse but never register. We also receive questions and enquiries which come through other channels rather than through the forum.
Bottom line is that forum isn't really a good guide to how many are using the PICAXE nor who they are.
I think Dippy is right that a lot of young people come here, problem solved and they go away, back on track and happy with what they are doing.
The great thing is that we have a lot of regulars who are happy to provide mentoring and help for those who do come here and we are very appreciative of that.
Pongo
Senior Member
This is just the personal opinion of another tedious retired boomer, but one who had a whole different career for >20 years after engineering and management in tech. I came up through the pre-teen kid fixing radios, ham license at an early age route, but I question whether tinkering with picaxe's is really the gateway to an engineering career in the 21st century. The good old days when we set off with a 'scope, and tobacco tins full of chips, to fix systems in nasty places are long gone, it's rare to see a field engineer do anything but swap boards or modules these days. When those dead parts go back to the shop they are either trashed or plugged into a diagnostic system that tells someone what to change out. Even back when I left hi-tech design engineering had moved to computer simulation. Many of the best engineers I worked with over the years had no hobby interest in electronics. For better or worse, what we remember as an electronic engineer's job is pretty much extinct these days, there are good careers there but they are not what we fondly recall and we need to think differently about how to guide young people towards them.
Cor, that was a long paragraph. Well, I'm sure that'll start a whole new debate
Personally, I think there are as many 'gateways' as there are definitions for 'engineer'.
But people will only approach the gate if something gets them interested.
PICAXE is one option. Arduino is another. If you have nothing then you may as well give up..
There's never a guarantee they'll continue afterwards. You can only lead a horse to water...
And I think there is now a cultural/perception problem.
In the UK the term 'engineer' (or scientist) now has a lower value (or status) than it used to.
And it seems that in places like Germany and Japan that 'engineers' get some respect.
Every little helps to inspire youngsters into a career.
Personally, I think there are as many 'gateways' as there are definitions for 'engineer'.
But people will only approach the gate if something gets them interested.
PICAXE is one option. Arduino is another. If you have nothing then you may as well give up..
There's never a guarantee they'll continue afterwards. You can only lead a horse to water...
And I think there is now a cultural/perception problem.
In the UK the term 'engineer' (or scientist) now has a lower value (or status) than it used to.
And it seems that in places like Germany and Japan that 'engineers' get some respect.
Every little helps to inspire youngsters into a career.
Eh, what do you expect when you have a thread entitled "Calling ALL Old Farts" ... Who else do you expect to call back!
(Reading thread through fascination, not eligibility!)
fernando_g
Senior Member
It is the same on this side of the pond. If you have not done so, search on Youtube for "The Knack".
Having said that...it appears that in Down Under, the electronics hobby is alive and well...but I really don't know. Maybe Westie, Manuka and other Aussies or Kiwis care to comment...maybe is a geomagnetic thing?
While working at SONY in the USA I was told that while engineers are respected in Japan, the engineers who get the most respect (and the biggest salaries, offices, etc,) aren't the electronics engineers, but the packaging (mechanical) engineers. They figure any EE can design the circuitry, but whoever can package the product best is the most valuable employee.
BTW, the electronics hobby is enjoying a modest resurgence in the USA, thanks to inexpensive, interesting and capable IC's, and powerful microcontrollers, along with Internet-supplied software routines and free support from places like this forum. There are both young and old hobbyists involved in this resurgence in the USA. The "Hackerspace" club movement in the US is a sign of that resurgence in the hobby.
While the focus of the Hackerspace community is DIY "just make something," much of that construction is electronics based. Hopefully I can pass on some of my "old-fart" knowledge to younger folks before I forget it all.
BTW, the electronics hobby is enjoying a modest resurgence in the USA, thanks to inexpensive, interesting and capable IC's, and powerful microcontrollers, along with Internet-supplied software routines and free support from places like this forum. There are both young and old hobbyists involved in this resurgence in the USA. The "Hackerspace" club movement in the US is a sign of that resurgence in the hobby.
While the focus of the Hackerspace community is DIY "just make something," much of that construction is electronics based. Hopefully I can pass on some of my "old-fart" knowledge to younger folks before I forget it all.
I will be 62 in June, have been playing with PICAXE for about a year now. This is a great forum, with great helpful people and lots of knowledge. I am amazed at what these chips can do and how easy it is to get them up and running, as I have never done any programing before. Keep up the good work. G. R.
Blazemaguire
Senior Member
30 years old.. Teaching electronics and systems and control in Surrey. You guys might all be old, but your time, guidance and experience is very valued! I dip in and out of the forum as and when I need help with student projects that are beyond me, or, more increasingly for personal projects. Somewhere along the line my work has turned into a Hobby and I now like playing with this stuff when I get the time, but baby on the scene now doesn't help now!
The willingness to share knowledge on this forum staggers me... I've had eclectic on here sending freebies out to our school to support my students on several occasions... something I never expected from 'random bloke on the internet' For every person who comments, I'm sure there are 100 more who lurk in the background making great use of this resource. Keep doing what you're doing!
The willingness to share knowledge on this forum staggers me... I've had eclectic on here sending freebies out to our school to support my students on several occasions... something I never expected from 'random bloke on the internet' For every person who comments, I'm sure there are 100 more who lurk in the background making great use of this resource. Keep doing what you're doing!
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Andres Rodriguez
New Member
72 (next month) Retired Civil Engineer and 5 years ago I decided to learn this black magic called electronics. I could no have gotten anywhere if it was no for this forum and all the kind members willing to share their knowledge.
The old engineering joke is that there are two types of engineers; mechanical that build weapon systems and civil that build targets.
Come on Lewisg -that's a rather dated joke- even (Vietnam era) 50 years back I recall "three types of engineers". The 3rd of course was/is related to e-tracking between launch system & target,and assessing the resulting outcome. Phew ...especially relevant in light of the ongoing Malaysian Airlines 777 mystery.
bfgstew
Senior Member
52 this year and have dabbled in electrics for the last 10 years and electronics for the last 3, mainly Picaxe.....................wish I had done it from an earlier age.
Again my thanks go to the forum and its extremely helpful, knowledgable and friendly members, without whom most projects would end up like me on a Saturday night..............flat on its face!
Just to add to the 'engineer debate', have a watch of these YouTube videos. One night we sat having a tea break, myself (a fitter) another and two electricians and an instrument tech and we howled with laughter, we had to watch it 4 times cos of missing bits through laughter. IF YOU ARE EASILY OFFENDED BY HARSH LANGUAGE DON'T WATCH.....................
Fitter V Electrician
Electrician V Instrument Technician
Again my thanks go to the forum and its extremely helpful, knowledgable and friendly members, without whom most projects would end up like me on a Saturday night..............flat on its face!
Just to add to the 'engineer debate', have a watch of these YouTube videos. One night we sat having a tea break, myself (a fitter) another and two electricians and an instrument tech and we howled with laughter, we had to watch it 4 times cos of missing bits through laughter. IF YOU ARE EASILY OFFENDED BY HARSH LANGUAGE DON'T WATCH.....................
Fitter V Electrician
Electrician V Instrument Technician
I work with a number of Old Fart EEs. More degrees than a mercury thermometer.
A wealth of experience and a wealth of old jokes, clichés, "the best engineer is a..." and "when I was at my previous place we invented...".
I get a cramp pretending I'm impressed
Yes, that Malaysian Airlines is a strange disaster.
Oddly, I haven't heard any mentions of conspiracy or Bermuda Triangles yet.
A wealth of experience and a wealth of old jokes, clichés, "the best engineer is a..." and "when I was at my previous place we invented...".
I get a cramp pretending I'm impressed
Yes, that Malaysian Airlines is a strange disaster.
Oddly, I haven't heard any mentions of conspiracy or Bermuda Triangles yet.
Yeah, goes back to at least the 1800's. What else to you expect in an "old farts" thread?
Exactly HOW would this "3rd" discipline not be part of the weapon system engineering? The numerical basics of targeting, trajectory and assessing outcome were quite developed by Napoleon's day.
One man's work is another man's dust...
The 1940 Blitz era "Battle of the Beams" makes great (Gerät?) reading.
Re: getting kids interested in electronics
Gave my oldest granddaughter a snap-together many-in-one electronics kit for her 8th birthday. My wife thought I was crazy and said so:
"She's a girl."
"She's not interested in things like that."
I followed my gut feeling of "she's curious about everything" and was proven correct. In a couple of days it was her favorite gift and relegated to the "holy of holies" for her toys - under her bed.
Her younger sister (5 at the time) was into the kit whenever the older sister wasn't home. The younger one especially liked the projects that made noise - not surprising, as she had previously asked for a set of drums (which I found on freecycle, so zero cost if that interest didn't last).
Currently don't see them enough to generate interest in the PICAXE - 600+ miles away does preclude dropping by for the day...
Gave my oldest granddaughter a snap-together many-in-one electronics kit for her 8th birthday. My wife thought I was crazy and said so:
"She's a girl."
"She's not interested in things like that."
I followed my gut feeling of "she's curious about everything" and was proven correct. In a couple of days it was her favorite gift and relegated to the "holy of holies" for her toys - under her bed.
Her younger sister (5 at the time) was into the kit whenever the older sister wasn't home. The younger one especially liked the projects that made noise - not surprising, as she had previously asked for a set of drums (which I found on freecycle, so zero cost if that interest didn't last).
Currently don't see them enough to generate interest in the PICAXE - 600+ miles away does preclude dropping by for the day...
papaof2: Guess that's one of the "snap" kits ? Perhaps rustle up a PICAXEd module,program it to do something then post it to her! Stan.
videos need NSFW tags