Windows 7 alternative?

eclectic

Moderator
Thanks Erco for your time and trouble.
Your thoughts may help others in future.

I've tried booting from USB twice now (2 hours plus each time)
It worked all the way until near the end, then ....

That's five attempts. Enough

Same error message.

In the words of Goldfinger ......

fail3f.jpg
 

techElder

Well-known member
I'm just durned sure that when it comes time that Windows 7 doesn't "work" anymore, I'm just going to buy another computer with the durned OS installed already. This upgrade BS that MS (notice the similarity?) puts us through is not worth messing with.
 

erco

Senior Member
@eclectic: Sorry to hear that, must be a hardware compatibility issue. Just curious, how old is that computer, and do you know what the original OS was? The oldest laptops I have updated are an Acer Aspire D250 netbook (originally Windows XP) and a Dell e5400, which still has the Windows VISTA sticker attached. Both run Win 10 fine (I didn't say fast!) and upgraded smoothly without any issues. That old Dell is strong and bulletproof, built like a brick outhouse. I use it for public demos when I know kids will be banging on the keyboard, my pool of cheap Toshibas would not stand up to that!

Here's an article on a guy who loaded Win10 on his old Acer netbook: https://www.techtimes.com/articles/71296/20150723/this-old-acer-aspire-one-can-handle-windows-10-video.htm

BTW, I did have one small (32GB SSD, 1GB RM) computer which was unable to update Win10. Same results as you, it grinded away for an hour or more then gave that same message you showed. But I didn't give up, as the computer wasn't that old. It came with Windows 10. I called Microsoft, a Tech in India took screen control for a long time and ultimately failed. He directed me to a Microsoft store and made an appointment. I dropped it off and 2 days later got it back all properly updated. That was last year, and since then it still can't do the big updates, so I'll probably have to make an annual pilgrimage to Microsoft for updates.
 

hippy

Technical Support
Staff member
Obviously you're aware that Windows 7 support ends Tuesday, thus Microsoft is urging users to update:
I'm occasionally reminded that XP support ended, now six years ago, but it just keeps on working as well as it ever did :)
 

mikeyBoo

Senior Member
Thoughts on moving to Windows 10.

Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated.
Every time I open Windows 10, I think of Steve Job’s “1984” commercial about IBM.
i.e. A dim flat 2-dimensional world of drab conformity. (Yuck!)

The sad part is because they have hobbled the underlying windowing system, a developer will have his app “uglified” by default. Classic Shell helps some but may break on any pending update.

I’ve decided to be optimistic & stay with Win10 until June. If they haven’t fixed the mess by then, I’ll just finish moving to OSX & use Linux Mint in place of Win10 & keep a copy of Win7 in an isolated VM just in case.

The only thing I’ve found so far that makes me very apprehensive is that Win10 has bugs in the file manager (yeah, I know, Microsoft is working on a fix). Hopefully, it’s not losing or altering any files, but I’m using the Mac side or Win10 xcopy to transfer files to USB drives (just in case).

The attached jpeg shows one of the file sys problems I’ve encountered (why Win10 is using an extra 10gB on a USB drive concerns me, telemetry?). Anyhow, formatting a USB drive in NTFS instead of exFat seems to fix the problem, but I’m still not feeling warm & fuzzy, hope it’s just an intermittent & harmless Win10 “feature”.

23482
 

eclectic

Moderator
IT's ALIVE! I'm on my "new" Win10 ex Win7

This might help others.

Help >> "Last known good Configuration"

I suggest you print the instructions.

Restart and keep pressing f8

Then using the usb stick run the

"setup" file


Then wait, responding occasionally to the prompts.

It's slow to start( only 4G RAM), but it's working
e
 
Last edited:

erco

Senior Member
Good to hear, eclectic! I was just about to forward this to you, which has some suggestions for that particular error. Attaching for reference now that you're a Win10 guru.

 

mikeyBoo

Senior Member
I would suspect that extra 10GB is "reserved storage"; it seems to be in the right ballpark for size -
Thanks Hippy, That sounds very likely. Hope it doesn’t reserve 10gB on a 16gB Flash drive (that could cause some comedy).

Hopefully there’s another young “Steve & Woz” working away on their new “Iron Man” operating system in their mom’s basement. It’s always the wild & crazy young nonconformists that come up with the good stuff.

“Ok Woz, snap your fingers on the “link to droid” orb. In the air right behind your head! Pay attention doofus!
Flipped the visor. Whoa, got the ranger’s climber! Check it out Woz! I’m takin’ this baby right up the side of the grand canyon! Whoa mama!”

“Steve, did you call me? What are you boys up to?”

And so it goes… Innovation to entropy. Deja vu all over again…
 

hippy

Technical Support
Staff member
Hope it doesn’t reserve 10gB on a 16gB Flash drive (that could cause some comedy).
I don't know. If it's a bootable drive then it perhaps could. I recall it caused some problems with Win 10 systems and tablets that were using smaller SSD's.

I've sworn off those ever since I picked up a Mini-PC with just 32GB and no DVD drive. After however many hours of it trying to update, it ended with a "something went wrong" error and just an "OK" button. Absolutely useless for diagnostics, and when I clicked "OK", it rebooted, and revealed it had completely wiped the OS, "black screen of death".

At least with a SATA drive one can replace it with another, can set that up on another PC, and there's far less chance of running out of space.
 

erco

Senior Member
I've sworn off those ever since I picked up a Mini-PC with just 32GB and no DVD drive. After however many hours of it trying to update, it ended with a "something went wrong" error and just an "OK" button.

I have a bunch of Toshiba 2GB RAM, 32GB SSD laptops. Windows burns up 20+GB on some of them! They work fine but require some creativity to keep updated. For major updates, they often ask you to add a USB drive with 10+ GB to shuffle files around during installation. I have found that using the "create media" option works well for these. That is, have the Windows Update on an external flash drive. If you choose to download the new Windows update directly to the small computer that will eat up 3GB of your 32GB storage, which causes storage problems.
 

mikeyBoo

Senior Member
thanks hippy & erco,
Y’all supplied some useful info. to ease the transition to Win10.

What I learned:
Win10 may decide to exercise “imminent domain” on any flash drive you plug in.
(My hard drive has ~700gB left, so don’t know why Win10 needed to reserve 10gB on my little flash drives)
Also learned that an external drive may be needed for upgrades.

For-what-it’s-worth dept. (Ain’t no such thing as a free lunch)

Windows 10 Leak Exposes Microsoft's New Monthly Charge (just enterprise customers? for now…)
https://www.forbes.com/sites/gordonkelly/2018/08/04/microsoft-windows-10-subscription-cost-price-upgrade-update-windows-7-8/#607e98d672c1
 

hippy

Technical Support
Staff member
"The fear has always been that this meant Microsoft would start charging users a monthly fee to maintain the operating system, and now a new leak has confirmed this is exactly what will happen"

In my personal view that is pure hyperbole, fearmongering, and extrapolating to the worst which may happen. There is no actual evidence I can see that "this is exactly what will happen". It seems the worst kind of trying to convince people that "could" means "absolutely will", and one needs to wonder why they would do that, why they would even want to, what purpose doing that is intended to serve ?

What Microsoft are doing - and they don't seem to have made any secret of it - is they are offering a service for businesses and educational establishment to manage their complete installation base for a fee so they don't have to do it themselves. There's nothing unusual about that or contracting others to do things one doesn't want to deal with oneself.

It's a huge jump from that to asserting every user will have to pay a subscription to use Windows 10. That seems to be based on the unfounded premise that Microsoft is determined to bleed everyone dry, and will, without any consideration as to what the consequences would likely be if they did do that or even tried to.

We will have to wait and see what actually happens. It seems rather pointless fretting over what might happen, as much as anyone might like us to do that. It's not like there wouldn't be any alternatives if it ever does happen.
 

techElder

Well-known member
"The fear has always been that this meant Microsoft would start charging users a monthly fee to maintain the operating system, and now a new leak has confirmed this is exactly what will happen"
When I read broad-brush statements like that, it tells me more about the sender than the receiver. :D (Of course, not implying Hippy said it.)
 

mikeyBoo

Senior Member
hi hippy,
It may or may not be hyperbole, but the fact it was published by Forbes (a business mag) caught my attention. Many premium software packages are already subscription based (e.g. Adobe, Corel (who purchased Parallels), IDM(UltraEdit), Microsoft Office, etc.). Some offer perpetual/subscription options on the way to subscription only.

I hope it is hyperbole, but if I were a betting man, I would bet Windows subscriptions are coming. Getting a lot of folks to pay a little every month is very lucrative (e.g. Netflix).

If Microsoft declares there will be a $5 per month support charge for all current Win10 PCs, it’s pretty much a certainty that 99.999% of folks would grumble a little, then comply. The vast majority of Windows users aren’t techies, so there would be no mass exodus to Linux. The “low monthly payment” psychology has been working for a very long time.

Money has to flow from somewhere to keep all those Microsoft programmers drinking soda & eating doughnuts.

It would be interesting to revisit this thread a year from now ‘cause the future is seldom what we think it will be.

Anybody wanna' prognosticate? Might be fun to take a guess on the future.
(Of course, if it's money & football, well my track record stinks.)
Y’all have a fun day!
 

Hemi345

Senior Member
(My hard drive has ~700gB left, so don’t know why Win10 needed to reserve 10gB on my little flash drives)
I'm gonna guess the file history service is enabled to keep previous versions of your files. It's a nice feature for having the capability to restore files that got accidently overwritten/corrupt/encrypted with ransomware, but sucks when you're already running low on disk space. Check the Control Panel / File History to see if it got enabled.

Anybody wanna' prognosticate? Might be fun to take a guess on the future.
It seems most software is moving toward the subscription model. I see the possibility of Windows 10 becoming available "free of charge" but with advertisements. Or you can pay a monthly fee of $5-9 to remove the ads. Either way, MS wins with the telemetry.
 

tmfkam

Senior Member
With the agreements MicroSoft has in place with King (creators of Candy Crush etc.) and others, to add and re-add if uninstalled, Candy Crush Saga type games to the Start menu, the 'advertising' has already started.

This partial quote from ZdNet:
In addition to those three games, Windows 10 downloaded Disney's Magic Kingdoms, Autodesk SketchBook, Dolby Access (offering a free trial of the Atmos surround-sound technology, with the option to pay $15 after the trial period ends), and Spotify Music.

If you're staring at that assortment of apps on a business PC and thinking it looks a lot like crapware, I'm not going to argue with you.

Those apps are preinstalled for purely financial reasons, with the app developers and Microsoft banking on the fact that some percentage of Windows 10 customers will run each app and pay for some sort of extra, like a Spotify music subscription. Microsoft, of course, gets a piece of the action.
 

Hemi345

Senior Member
I was thinking more than just the bloatware some come with (unless you buy the "Signature Edition" models). More like a scrolling ticker for current sales at Walmart, Amazon, etc running under the taskbar. Or popups with "special offers". Kinda like how the cheaper Amazon Kindle eReaders operate. Maybe MS will even make you sit through a video for hair care products before you're allowed to logon. :ROFLMAO:

Anyone remember the "Prodigy" dialup internet service of the 80s? We spent 90% of our time waiting for the advertisements to load at 14.4kb/s and 10% on the content we were looking for.
 

kfjl

Member
To be able to compare Windows to Linux, you need to know both systems.
With the raspberrypi, kids are using linux at school. They'll be able to choose between computing and Candy Crush.
Old folks will probably carry on using Windows and buying vacuum cleaners and encyclopaedias from door-to-door salesmen.
I don't think the new generation will.
 

hippy

Technical Support
Staff member
With the raspberrypi, kids are using linux at school. They'll be able to choose between computing and Candy Crush.
Sounds like a good reason to get PE compatible with linux systems to me.
Unfortunately it is not as simple as it sounds, and is even more complicated for a Raspberry Pi which is ARM-based, rather than X86.

The main problem with porting any Windows code is that it usually relies on Windows and third-party components to do some pretty big things. And if those aren't available for Linux one has to drop those and lose the functionality they provide, or recreate the same functionality oneself, and that is not usually a realistic proposition for most.

One therefore has to head towards the lowest common denominator and, once that's done, one ends up with a stripped-down version of what it was. Which for PE6 is pretty much LinAXEpad.

The PICAXE X86 Linux compilers do run on Raspberry Pi thanks to 'fanoush' figuring out how to achieve that, and they can be used with VS Code, though that isn't entirely without issue.

That open source code like VS Code, which is intended to work on everything, doesn't always work, even with Microsoft and a huge development team behind it, illustrates just how difficult porting can be. One can imagine how much more difficult it can be to get something never intended to work to do so.

It might be possible to get LinAXEpad running on a Raspberry Pi but I have never figured out how to. It needs people who have the knowledge and experience to figure that out and those who could help appear reluctant to do so when Microsoft, Windows, X86 or closed-source is involved. Some in the Pi community are ideologically hostile to the very notion of anything which doesn't fit their view of how things should be and will even actively discourage giving such assistance.
 
Top