No CODE MODE at PicaxeCloud.com

papaof2

Senior Member
Worked for me - but I might have cheated: using Windows XP and its latest (but still older) version of Chrome.
I'm using the XP machine with VB6 to investigate why a program that's been running for years (including under Win 10) has suddenly started throwing an "overflow" error at startup in Win 10 - but only when the Win 10 laptop is running on battery, not when it's on AC power.
The Win 10 laptop is at the other end of the house and I won't be back there for a while :-(
 

steliosm

Senior Member
Just tested on Firefox running on a linux machine. Works fine. I'm able to switch to Basic mode and type new commands, check and download the .axe file.
Any chance you need to update your browser?
 

erco

Senior Member
XP? Linux? Firefox? Yowsah. Thanks for the feedback

I'm on a plainjane Win10 desktop with latest Chrome version. Probably like most people. I figured if there is a special Chrome book-only app then the cloud version should work with Chrome.

I'll try later on a fire fox machine at home. Will advise.

BTW Happy Fathers Day to all!
 

Flenser

Senior Member
When I contact IT support for my problems with browser apps now the first thing I get asked is "have you tried clearing all the caches and restarting the browser?" and for some problems this has worked.
 

erco

Senior Member
Firefox works, but not Chrome or MS Edge. I tried Flenser's suggestions to no avail.
 
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papaof2

Senior Member
Chrome and Edge are the "newest and best" versions - and the developers broke or changed something that they didn't know how to test?
 

oracacle

Senior Member
It sound like it could be a problem with chromium, the open source base for both edge and chrome amoung others.
A quick search inidicated that it was last updated 20/06/22 but I doubt those updates will have filtered down as yet, and may not do so for while, and may still not fix the issue. There may also be something that has not been updated on the picaxe end of things.
You could look at trying some other chromium based browsers as confimration, and for that matter other browsers that are not chromium based too.
 

hippy

Technical Support
Staff member
It sound like it could be a problem with chromium, the open source base for both edge and chrome amoung others.
Indeed. This does appear to have been a change in the Google browser engine which has affected everything which uses it. There is a potential solution suggested by Technical here ...

 

erco

Senior Member
That's quite the showstopper for teacher DrewWills who first reported the problem Mar 29, on class Chromebooks, his students' only option. What a shame the school year ended with no solution found.
 

hippy

Technical Support
Staff member
That's quite the showstopper for teacher @DrewWills who first reported the problem Mar 29, on class Chromebooks, his students' only option. What a shame the school year ended with no solution found.
I hope Rev-Ed is actively pursuing a solution to this since education is such a huge chunk of their business.
We are doing what we can but can only do so much when a browser developer changes how things work. The problem really isn't of our making;; the code worked with Chrome, still works with Firefox and other browsers.
 

erco

Senior Member
We are doing what we can but can only do so much when a browser developer changes how things work. The problem really isn't of our making; the code worked with Chrome, still works with Firefox and other browsers.
Doesn't matter if Chrome changed, it's definitely RevEd's problem and nothing to shrug shoulders about when Chrome dominates Firefox by an order of magnitude in the UK and around the world. Web developers are abundant and widely available to keep your apps updated & functional. Otherwise, start building business opportunities in Cuba and Cameroon.

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firefox.001.jpg
 

oracacle

Senior Member
Just a quick question on that, how much of the that percentage is down to android phone users? There are an aweful lot of them out there, about 80% of the market IIRC.
 

Jeff Haas

Senior Member
Chrome has been the dominant web browser for years. When I was working on web stuff, if someone at a client complained that something didn't work in a non-Chrome browser, the advice was to always try Chrome. It got to the point where we wouldn't even test on the other browsers, there just wasn't the market share to justify it.
 

erco

Senior Member
A quick Google search indicates that the actual number is more like 65% as of last month

Have you got a source for your info
Does that REALLY matter? Are you making the argument it's OK to ditch Chrome and Chromebook users?

Fact 1: The lion's share of worldwide browsers are Chrome.
Fact 2: A Chromebook-only teacher complained to the forum that his class was crippled.
Fact 3: Rev-Ed makes a bunch, if not most of its money from the educational market.

I'm surprised that more people aren't concerned by this. This should set off alarm bells. It's a dog-eat-dog world out there, there is no shortage of alternate microprocessors for schools to choose from, most of which offer more modern hardware, features, programming languages, connectivity, speed, memory. If Rev-Ed just blames Google and says "not my job", then end is near.

Me? I like Picaxes, I would just like like to see Rev-Ed survive.
 

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papaof2

Senior Member
School budgets are usually limited. Equipment is purchased from the 'lowest cost' provider that meets their requirements, with an expectation on X years of service from the equipment. If the equipment no longer works - regardless of reason, it's either fix the problem or cancel the class.
Typical arguments for not moving to a more expensive system:
1. It's not in the budget.
2. Kids don't really need to know anything about computers, do they?
 

oracacle

Senior Member
The fact that more haven't raised it as an issue should be an indication of how much its used, or for that matter not used. Why put effort into something that is used by just a handful of users. The simple fact is there are a fair amount of us that didn't even realize that that service even existed before an issue was raised the other day.

IMHO The biggest problem here is the fact that PICAXE is not open source, the Arduino cloud have not seen an issue which is built on open source. This means you can save a large Low cost team of programmers to fix things. And arguably the front end could well be open source for PICAXE which should go a ways to keeping these issued to s minimum.

There is a whole other argument to be had about cloud services, and security of showing them to access ports on your local machine
 

hippy

Technical Support
Staff member
Doesn't matter if Chrome changed, it's definitely RevEd's problem and nothing to shrug shoulders about when Chrome dominates Firefox by an order of magnitude in the UK and around the world.
If Rev-Ed just blames Google and says "not my job", then end is near.
That is all quite insulting to Rev-Ed.

We have been as screwed by whatever change has happened as much as anyone has. It's not our fault that perfectly good code which worked for years on Chrome and everything else suddenly stopped working because of some change in Chrome. It worked on Chrome and it still works on Firefox and other browsers.

We didn't change anything but Chrome has. We didn't cause the problem, Google did.

I don't know what you think our perfectly valid, written as recommended, was and is working code, should be changed to in order to make it work with Chrome which no longer works as it did. We don't - if we did we would have done it. That hasn't stopped us investigating the issue and trying to find a workaround but, no, we don't have one yet.

The issue is akin to "Clicking on the <a href="https://www.google.com">Google</a> link does nothing". Exactly how are we meant to fix that when it's Google's browser engine no longer doing what it is meant to, what it used to do, what other browsers still do ?
 

erco

Senior Member
That is all quite insulting to Rev-Ed.
Apologies. Pardon my offense, my intent was only to express concern for a product and company I love. A previous reply seemed rather nonchalant and noncommittal:

We are doing what we can but can only do so much

But now it sounds like the work is ongoing:

That hasn't stopped us investigating the issue and trying to find a workaround but, no, we don't have one yet.
That's all I wanted to hear. Presumably you have the situation under control and don't feel a need to post all of the goings-on of Rev-Ed's business on the forum, and I respect that. Literally my motivation for raising this flag was your reference of Drew Will's classroom issue, which appears to be important but unresolved. I also teach, and IMO supporting teachers and resolving problems quickly is of prime importance. I try to assist where possible, here indirectly by being a giant PITA, or sometimes directly, in another forum.
 

erco

Senior Member
The fact that more haven't raised it as an issue should be an indication of how much its used, or for that matter not used. Why put effort into something that is used by just a handful of users. The simple fact is there are a fair amount of us that didn't even realize that that service even existed before an issue was raised the other day.
Sounds reasonable. I might agree with that logic, except that in several previous threads over the years, I have asked about the sizeable student/teacher demographic. The answer is always the same: students & teachers rarely, if ever, visit the forum. For whatever reason, academics and forumistas are two ships that pass in the night and never meet. Granted, I started this thread while just playing around with the online blockly app, which I may never need. No biggie for me. But when hippy shared the link from teacher Drew Wills (part of the mostly silent academic group) which shared that that this issue is unresolved, that concerned me. I do some teaching as well, with various microcontrollers. I know for a fact that on the Parallax site, one of the students' favorite features is the ability to generate their proprietary SPIN language code from Blockly to study & learn... exactly what the problem is here. As a result, I have no doubt that pursuing a solution here for the silent students is worthwhile, even if forumistas rarely or never use it.
 

papaof2

Senior Member
Probably need some statistics that PICAXE considers company private: how many classes of how many total students at how many schools in how many countries - and the percentage of those using Chromebooks - might give an indication of the efforts PICAXE corporate has been making in behalf of their clients - but Google is a big elephant to try to move... and PICAXE funds are probably small compared to Google's. Time for some global ainti-trust legislation?
 

hippy

Technical Support
Staff member
We value all our customers equally; hobbyists, makers, students, educationalists, industrial and commercial. We are also equally unhappy and frustrated that, whatever Google have changed, is preventing our code which used to work with Chrome-based browsers from doing so, whether that's using PC, Chromebooks or anything else.

We are well aware that Google's change has screwed teachers and their students, especially those using Chromebooks. It was Google which did that. It was Google which screwed those students and teachers, not us.

There is nothing wrong with our code; it worked with Chrome and it still works with Firefox and other browsers. It is plain and simply something Google has changed which is what has stopped it working how it used to, how it is meant to.

We would like to find a resolution as much as anyone else. It is unfortunate and regrettable that we have not been able to do so, that Google's change is causing knock-on consequences for students, teachers and others.

Imagine if your parents had told you; to get an orange iced lolly you should ask the ice cream vendor "Please can I have an orange iced lolly". That works for years. Then one day the ice cream vendor you have regularly used just stares back at you blankly. It used to work, other ice cream vendors still comply with what's asked, just this one and those in the same franchise no longer do.

How are your parents expected to come up with a solution to that ?

The problem isn't with what your parents told you, what you are doing. It worked, still does work with other vendors, it's just this vendor and those in the franchise ignoring what you ask for.
 

erco

Senior Member
Squeaky wheel gets the grease. Find out and tell us who & where at Google that forumistas, teachers and students can email to report and complain about the problem. They need to be aware that it's a real problem for lots of people.

Make a new thread encouraging all forumistas to email Google, whether they need/want/use the feature or not. Power to the people!
 

hippy

Technical Support
Staff member

There is usually a process within schools and the like through which issues can be reported and pursued and we would recommend those be followed. Many schools will have staff specifically dealing with the installation and deployment of Chromebooks so they would probably be the best people to deal with the issue.
 
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