Newbie Artist Needs help

[butgrape]

Hi

I am an artist currently doing work with a group of dyslexic children for a literature festival. The work is based around dyslexia. I want to reverse a Simon says game to opposite colours to make the sequencing a little harder, for example, simon says ‘blue, blue, green’ the correct answer would be ‘green, green, blue’.. get it?

Here’s were I need help; I have an old super simon game and have just ordered the simon game kit from PICAXE education. They have told me I will be able to program the supplied controller chip to do what I want it to do myself.

I want to fix that chip into the circuitry of the old super simon game or adjust the amount of power going the PICAXE simon game to power larger bulbs rather than the LEDs with the game.

The chap at PICAXE said that this is basic stuff and would be easy for someone who has a basic knowledge of electronics. I don’t have even a basic knowledge! He said the best thing for me to do would to get on this forum and find some one near by (Manchester UK) to help me. He said I would most probably find someone out there! So, is there anybody there? please????

Thanks, Martin

 

[BeanieBots]

Well, what you were told is true.
You can program it yourself and you will get all the help you need here.
The hardware changes needed to drive "larger bulbs" is also very easy but only if you know how!
If you can find someone local who can give hands on help, then great.
If not, then all is not lost. Circuits can be published here to help you although everything you will need to know can be found in the interfacing manual.

What size "bulbs" are you thinking of using?
That choice will determine the best approach for the required hardware upgrade.
If you are a novice, I would strongly suggest avoiding mains bulbs for safety reasons.
An option worth considering would be the latest 12v LED spot lights.
These are very bright and are available in many colours. Getting high brightness from 'regular' incandescent bulbs with coloured gel filters can be very inefficient and the results can be disspointing. LEDs produce coloured light so there is no light loss for each colour.
A 3W blue LED will give about the same amount of light as a 40W blue incandescent bulb. It will also run cool enough to touch which can't be said for a 40W bulb.

 

[Rickharris]

Let us know when you get all the bits together - if necessary perhaps some kind person might offer to do the job for you if you have the bits.

Watch this space!

 

[butgrape]

Wow!! Great guys, thanks for your help! I will take your advice on bulbs and get back to you whan I have got all the bits together. Still waiting for the PICAXE Simon to arrive. I reckon I should be able to get all the bits togehter within the next week.... watch this space!

 

[butgrape]

Newbie artist needs help

Right, I have all the bits now, I think. That is the Picaxe simon game and the Old 70's super simon. I want to re program the Picaxe simon to accept opposite colors for as the answer to its question i.e. Q = B,B,G A = GGB. I also want to adapt it to power bigger bulbs. Anyone in Manchester area around? Or can anyone tell me what to do over this forum?

Martin

 

[Rickharris]

Right, I have all the bits now, I think. That is the Picaxe simon game and the Old 70's super simon.

Ok the super simon was a 2 player game so you will need 2 sets of the simon kit axe 106 as sold by rev ed? - you have these? and you have read through the data sheet for the kit.

The programme generates a list of 100 random numbers that control which light is on these are stored in the picaxe memory. The read command gets them back by following a loop. A counter keeps track of how many sequences you have done and takes that many numbers from the list so you need to :

existing code:

for counter = 1 to topstep ‘  for...next loop
   read counter,value ‘ get value
   gosub beep ‘ make the noise
   pause 300 ‘ short delay
next counter ‘ loop

Where counter points to the number required, and the count goes from 1 to topstep.

So to read in reverse you need to make the loop go in reverse from topstep to 1.

e.g.

for counter = topstep to 1 step -1 ‘  for...next loop
   read counter,value ‘ get value
   gosub beep ‘ make the noise
   pause 300 ‘ short delay
next counter ‘ loop

I want to re program the Picaxe simon to accept opposite colors for as the answer to its question i.e. Q = B,B,G A = GGB.

Have a good read through the explanation of the programme and a good read of the actual programme, it is well commented. You don't need to type it in it is in the samples folder with the programme editor.

Oh by the way the reverse of BBG would be GBB

I also want to adapt it to power bigger bulbs. Anyone in Manchester area around? Or can anyone tell me what to do over this forum?

Martin

Why do you want bigger bulbs - do you mean physically bigger ir brighter?

The kit uses LEDs and I think you will find these quite bright and they use much less electricity than the old simon bulbs.


Initially I would gut the simon says, replace the innards with the kit and get it working as it normally should - then you have a good basis to play with the programme.

IF you need to change to bigger - brighter bulbs you will need to add some interfacing because the picaxe will not drive bulbs directly.

Have a look at the interface manual as well.

 

[BeanieBots]

Rick, I might have this wrong but I think butgrape means opposite colour as apposed to reversed order.

Butgrape,
What exactly does "opposite colour" mean?

On the board red is opposite green and yellow is opposite blue.
So BBG would either be YYR (opposite colour) or GBB (reverse order).
I don't understand how GGB is derived from BBG.

Aslo, you have not said how "big" you want your bulbs or what type of power you have/want to use.

 

[Rickharris]

The super Simon is laid out side by side so no opposites - I guess I could have mis-understood.

 

[butgrape]

Thanks for responding... regretting that stupid user name now!!! its Martin!

Sorry for the delay getting back… no internet at home at the moment.

I don’t think I explained what I want to do very well, and it has changed a little since my fist post as well.

So what I want to do is:
Make a large Simon game that will be mounted on a gallery wall. I would like it to work the same way as a normal single player simon but with the exception that you input a different sequence of colours to get the right answer. For example, on the wall next to the game there will be a key:
'green = red,
Red = Blue,
Blue = yellow,
Yellow = Green'.

As well as remembering the sequence simon ‘says’, the player will also have to remember the colour key, so if the sequence was red, red Green the answer would be blue, blue, red.

I am going to use push wall lights mounted on plastic for the interface, stripping out all the electronics and just using the push mechanism for the big light up bottons of the simon game. I think the first thing to do is to get the electronics of the game sorted first.

So it think what I need to do is:
a; program the Picaxe simon game to do what I want it to do.
b; Mondify it so that it can power larger/brighter bulbs
c; put the picaxe simon components (buttons and lights) on the end of wires so that I can fit them into a lager interface of my wall mounted simon game.

So… am I way out of my depth?! I must admit that coding info (topstep etc) went way over my head!

 

[Mycroft2152]

I think the Major Simon game is very do-able.

1. As far as the "reverse" answers, wouldn't it be simplest to just relabel the switches? The software doesn't care about the names of the switches, just that each switch is related to a specific color.

2. Each PICAXE output can drive a transistor or relay to turn on the large light bulbs. You'll have to make sure the power supply is large enough for both.

3. Swicthes and lamps at the end of the wires should be OK, just don't make them a couple of kilometers long

Myc

***Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic!***

 

[butgrape]

Hi, Thanks

1. As far as the "reverse" answers, wouldn't it be simplest to just relabel the switches? The software doesn't care about the names of the switches, just that each switch is related to a specific color.

That was my original thinking. There will be 4 buttons on the wall. Simon will give a sequence i.e. blue, red, blue. I could swap the switches around so that the blue switch is under the yellow button with the light bulb for that button (as in the key above). However, if I did that, wouldn’t the blue button light up rather than the yellow one you are pressing it to give the answer?!!

I need in to work so that the lights correspond to the colours/buttons you press. So Simon says blue, red, blue. The blue button lights up, then the red etc. To give the correct answer you press yellow - the yellow button lights up (not the blue), green – the green button lights up, etc (as in the above key). Does this make sense!?

2. Each PICAXE output can drive a transistor or relay to turn on the large light bulbs. You'll have to make sure the power supply is large enough for both.

How do I go about this? Does this mean that I attach a wire to the output for say the yellow LED that goes to a transistor or relay and then on to the larger bulb? I am totally new to working with electronics so......

3. Switches and lamps at the end of the wires should be OK, just don't make them a couple of kilometers long

Do I solder the wires to the appropriate contacts on the PCB?


Thanks for your help…. I hope you have the patience as well as the knowledge for me!!!

 

[Mycroft2152]

A quick look at the schematic on the data sheet shows that the switches are separate from the LEDs.

Check out Manual #3 (Interfacing sircuits) to see how to drive a lamp or relay.

Hpow big is the Major simon game going to be?

Myc

 

[Rickharris]

OK - Exactly how big do you want this to be?

The electronics isnt a real problem and once I understand what you want to acheive I can proberble help you there - I am a teacher in lincolnshire but the post is fairy good

How big do these lights need to be - mains bulbs and by big do you mean physically big or bright?

Changing the lables for the switches is an easy way to go.

Not at all sure what you intend to do with the simon says game you have as you don't realy need it as far as I can see.

 

[Mycroft2152]

Trying not to cloud the issue here, nor being branded as a heretic, my first reaction was just to hack one of the commercial units. Extending the switches and replacing the LEDs with opto couplers to drive lamps would be a quick build.

Of course, not as much fun nor learning experience as building from scratch with a PICAXE.

 

[butgrape]

Hi

I think the whole thing will be about 1 and 1/2 meters long and a foot. The buttons will be in a row. Each button will be made from a push wall light so will be about the size of your hand - 14cm diameter (see attached pic).

I think I mean bright rather than big... and coloured if possible. If you picture this on a gallery wall the lights need to be bright enough to be seen from a distance.

Im not sure swapping the labels for the switches will work. If I put the yellow switch under the blue button wouldn’t the blue button light up when I push the yellow button? Rather than the yellow button lighting up when pressed? Ok that sounds very confusing!!! start again!:

Round 1
Simon says 'blue'. Blue button flashes

Player looks at key, 'Blue = yellow'

Player pushes yellow button. Yellow button flashes when pushed.

Correct answer

Round 2
Simon says ‘blue, red’, blue button flashes, red button flashes

Player looks at key ‘Blue = yellow, Red = Blue’

Player pushes yellow, yellow flashes, Player pushes Blue, Blue Flashes

Correct Answer

Etc

Could this be achieved by changing the switch labels?

Am I misunderstanding what you mean by changing labels?


Thanks again, I really apreciate the help.. which is very much needed.

 

[Mycroft2152]

The simlplest way to understand the logic is to assign numbers to each of the buttons and lights. This is what the program does.

Light #..........Button #
1 .................1
2 .................2
3 .................3
4 .................4

Normally the light colors and the button labels are the same:

Light#.....Color..........Button#....Label
1 ----- red ..............1 ------ red
2 ----- blue .............2 ------ blue
3 ----- yellow ..........3 ------ yellow
4 ----- green ...........4 -------green

For your game:

Light#.....Color..........Button#........"Label"
1------red.................1---------"blue"
2------blue................2---------"red"
3------yellow.............3---------"green"
4------green..............4---------"yellow"

When simon flashes lights 1,3 (Red, Yellow), the correct answer is buttons 1,3 (blue, green).

This will only work when the lights and buttons are widely separated, not if the button is next to the light.

Hope this helps.

Myc

 

[butgrape]

Yep, thats it........ I think! Almost! Maybe?!

With the original simon game, the lights are also buttons. 4 buttons/lights. When you press the green button, it lights up green. I would like my game to do that as well.

So taking your example, simon flashed 1,3 (red, yellow) to get the correct answer In my game I press buttons I,3 (blue, green). When I press buttons 1,3 (blue, green) I want the buttons to light up (blue, green) as I press them, (which would be lights 2,4/blue and green), not the red and yellow buttons (lights 1,3).

Can that be done? by switching the lables the way you've described? Im I hopelessly confusing everything?!

 

[Mycroft2152]

I think there is a missing piece of the puzzle.

You described it as 1.5 meters long by a foot, with 4 push wall lights as switches


Does this mean this is a set of lights and a set of lighted buttons?

Or just the set of push wall lights acting as both?

If the wall lights are acting a both, then you have limits on which bulb you can use without melting the plasitic.

Perhaps a simple drawing would help us understand.

 

[Technical]

We think the issue here is that on the original game the light is actually inside the switch. So to press the 'blue colour' you do have to press the switch above the 'blue bulb'.

However the target audience has probably never even heard of the 1970s game, so does the bulb really have to be inside the switch? - the Simon Says kit is and LED beside the switch and it works fine.

With such a large reproduction display we thinking hacking the original electronics is a bit pointless. You could just use the CHI035 18 pin high power project board direct - 4 switches connected to inputs and 4 bulbs connected to the FET outputs. This resolves all your electronics issues, but with the same PICAXE program as in the Simon Says kit.

 

[butgrape]

Attached is a picture of what I want to do.

yes, in my game the buttons are the lights.

My simon has 4 light up buttons about 18cm in diametre. Each button lights up when I press it. Simon flashs red, red, yellow. I looks at the key and see that the correct answer is green, green, blue. I press the green button and it lights up green, I press it again and it lights up and then I press the blue button and it lights up blue. Simon tells me I am correct.

With the Picaxe simon kit, does the (for example) red LED light up when you press the RED switch? If I put the red switch under the green button, wouldn't the Red button light up rather than the green one?

Ideally, I would like the buttons to light up as you press them. Press green = Green Lights up.

Can I do this with the Picaxe simon?

 

[butgrape]

woops

oops forgot to attach picture

 

[Mycroft2152]

Since you are just starting out with PCAXE, you should start simple. Buy and assemble the Simon board and get familiar with it and the program. Then 'tweak' the program to do what you want. Only then consider building a full size version.

You can also use the PICAXE simulator to run the Simon Program. You will have to make one change in the program to make it work under the newest version, change all instances of "LOOP" to "LOOP1". "LOOP" is now a reserved keyword.

Note to Technical: the Simon datasheet needs to be updated.

One more thought, the lights you described have push on - push off switch. You will need to change these to a momentary contact switch to work.

Myc