18M question....

[Buryboy2000]

Hi guys, hopefully someone can answer this quickly. Last week I ordered some PICAXE18 chips from Rapid but they didn't deliver them saying they were discontinued. When I phoned them they said the product had been directly replaced with the 18M and would I like those instead. I took them as they didn't have the others but over the weekend realised that the new chips might not be programable with older software. If not I need to do a whole new image of the machines in my department! So the question is can version 5.0.7 program the new 18M chips?
Thanks
Oli

 

[manuka]

The 18M should certainly cut the mustard software wise compared with that older PICAXE-18, & is apparently a drop in replcament able to be programmed both as a classic "18" & new "18M". Yah! See => http://www.rev-ed.co.uk/docs/picaxe18m.pdf In fact you may well be the first to have one on a confirmed order, as they (& especially their 28X2/40X2 big brothers) have been -ahem- keenly awaited by the rest of us.

Just what are you wanting to actually do ? Would a 08M,14M or even 20M be suitable? Stan

 

[Buryboy2000]

I just need to know if I can program them with the version 5.0.7 of the programming software. The chips will be doing a variety of things in pupils coursework. Although you've now got me worried that they are going to take ages to get here and I need the coursework finished by Easter!

 

[BeanieBots]

To answer your question simply,
NO, you will NOT be able to program them.

Support for the 18M was not added until PE version 5.2.2.
You will need to upgrade.

As for compatability, it should be pin for pin and fully compatable with all the lower spec 18 series PICAXEs.

EDIT:
I stand corrected. See post below.

 

[hippy]

Welcome to the PICAXE forum.

For the 'full PICAXE-18M experience' it would be recommended to download the latest 5.2.2 Programming Editor.

Having anticipated problems like this, it is possible to program code written for a PICAXE-18A into a PICAXE-18M using older versions of the Programming Editor; write the code as if you have an 18A, select 18A from View->Options, connect to an 18M, download, run.

There are a couple of restrictions and caveats ( which I will have to get back to you with details on ) but for the majority of simple programs that may be the most appropriate way to proceed.

 

[Buryboy2000]

Thanks Hippy. That was the info I needed!

 

[westaust55]

PICAXE 18M question

@Buryboy2000,
Welcome to the PICAXE forum.

Might I ask why you are seeking to stay with the V5.0.7 Programming Editor.

At the Rev Ed website (they are the makers of the PICAXE chips using standard PIC chips) you can download for FREE the Programming Editor Update patch. In the words of Rev Ed:
"If you have already have v5.0.0 (or later) installed you can use this patch (9MB) to upgrade to version 5.2.2. If you are still using version 4.x (or earlier) please use the full install instead."

It is free and gives you access to all the new features of the 18M.
Plus there other new helpful features in V5.2.2.

 

[hippy]

I think the main reasons to stick with older software ( and this applies to all software, not just the Programming Editor ) ...

1) What's installed works, or works well enough
2) The effort required in upgrading
3) The consequential risks of upgrading

The later two are particularly the case in education where upgrades may have to be rolled out across a whole network.

First, it needs authorising, then someone with access has to be found to do the upgrade, and that has to be scheduled. If the install breaks something else that can a nightmare to fix, may bring everything on the network to a standstill and require 'fire fighting' to get them back working again, throwing other schedules out the window. What's installed has to be tested and if there are problems, the whole process has to be gone through to restore to where it was.

That's often a good incentive to go along with, "if it ain't broken, don't fix it". Or to do the upgrades outside of term time where problems can be more easily fixed without jeopardising student's learning.

 

[manuka]

Rest easy! I've upgraded the PICAXE editor many times (over numerous PCs) since 2002 & never had a single issue. However I'm a great fan of "oldie but goodie" serial D9 fitted standalone laptops for schools electronics lab/PICAXE use, & can certainly relate to the admin hassles. However these sorts of issues often arise to taunt teachers with "a class in the next 10 minutes", so you'll have bags of time given the Easter deadline.

But why are you not starting with the 08M ? This is not only better established for schools use & super easy for newbies to get to grips with, but deceptively powerful. Even after 5 years many of us old hands are still exploring further 08M tweaks! See => www.picaxe.orcon.net.nz perhaps. Stan

 

[westaust55]

Rest easy! I've upgraded the PICAXE editor many times (over numerous PCs) since 2002 & never had a single issue. However I'm a great fan of "oldie but goodie" serial D9 fitted standalone laptops for schools electronics lab/PICAXE use, & can certainly relate to the admin hassles. However these sorts of issues often arise to taunt teachers with "a class in the next 10 minutes", so you'll have bags of time given the Easter deadline.

But why are you not starting with the 08M ? This is not only better established for schools use & super easy for newbies to get to grips with, but deceptively powerful. Even after 5 years many of us old hands are still exploring further 08M tweaks! See => www.picaxe.orcon.net.nz perhaps. Stan

Concur with Manuka wrt PE upgrade.
I have the PE software installed on at numerous PC's (at a private level) and have upgraded with patches each time an update has come out without problem with the installation.

 

[BeanieBots]

Very easy if you are ALLOWED to do it.
Most 'organisations' which have an IT department don't give 'users' enough permissions to install or alter software. Only THEY can do that and only when it suites THEM. Just putting in a request for it to be done can be a days work
This is done to "protect" the establishment from the likes of pirate software being installed which can render the establishment vulnerable to prosecution.

 

[SilentScreamer]

As a student I can say that for my school at least the main problem is getting technicians to either setup network installs (the normal method which often kills the network ) or to install software on each machine. Took 6 months at my school to get an upgrade from 4.x to 5.2.1

 

[manuka]

All the more reason to use standalone old laptops that never see the normal network. In fact I've never run the PICAXE editor on a wired network, & other than "copy & paste" PICAXE routines off the web (easily WiFi handled), I see little reason to - especially in today's empowered netbook age.

Old laptops (even W98) are often free to a good home ! I've about a dozen shot battery Toshiba CDT480s that cost ~US$10 each, & I've never had any complaints, even at tertiary level,about their PICAXE use. Increasingly of course many students now HAVE their own laptop/netbook & will download the editor themselves anyway. You can hence run an electronics class almost anywhere.

But- silly me- of course many institutions have USB memory stick policies now too. It makes one wonder at times if institutional IT techs. delight in holding all the trump cards. Well - silly me again-of COURSE they do - see => http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bastard_Operator_From_Hell & the likes of the rousing "3A" tale at => http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/10/03/bofh_2008_episode_32/ Warning - BOFH tales make addictive reading, so plan for an extended session.

I recall much the same culture back in the early 70s in fact,when even the most trivial number crunching had to be done in the booked & staffed site "calculator facility". Somewhat in the same frustration mode that lead to my PICAXE find in 2002, I eventually spent the equiv. of a weeks wages on a personal red LED 4 function calculator. Yes -good old + - ÷ * & inferior to the sort of thing coin shops now sell. Predictably this then had the admin. fuming that I was guilty of " sabotaging the system"...

 

[hippy]

Programming 18M using 18A selection

The following restrictions apply when programming the PICAXE-18M as if it were a PICAXE-18A.

The following 18M commands are not available for use -

* CONNECT
* DISCONNECT
* INFRAOUT
* PLAY
* PWMOUT
* SERRXD
* TUNE

The following 18A / 18M commands must not be used -

* INFRAIN
* INFRAIN2
* KEYIN
* READOWCLK
* RESETOWCLK

Additional Notes -

Any Eeprom data specified using EEPROM or DATA commands will not be loaded to the 18M; all 18M Eeprom data will be initialised to zero. The 18M has shared code and data, not separate code and data areas. READ and WRITE commands will work but must operate in accordance with the shared code and data constraints ( as per 08M etc ).

Specifying N300 or T300 baud rates for SERIN or SEROUT will result in a 4800 baud rate being used; 300 baud will only be achievable by under-clocking to 2MHz and using N600 or T600.